“Every time the conversation slips into abstractions, one of the women pulls it back to women’s complex everyday realities.” quote made me think of the recent clip of Saoirse Ronan on the Graham Norton show, when the other male actors on the couch are laughing about how ridiculous it would be to use your phone as a self defense weapon and "who would ever think to do that?!". And then she cuts in with "Women think about that every single day" and the entire room went silent and still...
Just sat and read through this while nodding constantly. Yes. A million times yes. Talked to a guy who said he liked Trump 'for his economy benefits' and he of course couldn't see past his white male privilege and understand why that's the most idiotic thing ever spoken. Needless to say, he's been blocked on everything and I sit in my feminist bed with my feminist blankets and my feminist books - alone. Happily alone with my “high” standards and with my values💋💕
The average man is not like this. Of course you shouldn't have low standards; all women should have standards they can live with. But cherry-picking the worst men and using those as stand-in representatives of the entire population of men is not helpful.
This essay would be the same as a man saying "the average woman is a hyper-liberal, money-grubbing, brainwashed, anti-family, weaponized-compassion leftie who just wants to put a dog leash on me and show the world how she finally tamed the oppressor." Which is, obviously, profoundly untrue. The vast majority of women are not like that. The vast majority of women are just trying to get by and find someone to love them. Same as most men.
What you're doing is nothing more than the direct opposite of the manosphere you apparently hate so much. Essays like this accomplish nothing other than to further echo negative sentiments that are solving exactly zero problems.
And yes, you do have to compromise to make relationships work. I don't know why we've forgotten that. Compromise on your most important values? Of course not. But compromise on some of your values? Yes. Anything else is a fairy tale.
If the result of the election doesn’t peel the veil of “the vast majority of men is not like this” I don’t know what does anymore lol. You are trying to frame this phenomenon as an ideological divide and this logic just doesn’t work when one group’s rights are at risk lmao.
where does the claim “just as many women voted for Trump as men did” come from? You can’t just make a claim without backing it up with voting statistics. There has been, historically, a gender gap in voting behavior, and 2024 is no exception. https://infogram.com/gender-gap-in-voting1992-2024-all-voters-1hnq41o3mmepk23
I think if you looked at the demographics of men that someone interacting in this substack would meaningfully have to interact with (men living in or around large liberal urban centers), you'd find that the *vast majority* of them voted Dem. You're making the same error that people who talk about "red states" and "blue states" make which is that the real divide is urban / rural and city Alabama will have more Dem voters than going 50 miles east of San Francisco.
I wonder how do you explain the existing gender gap between men and women’s voting behavior, and the changes in different racial demographic’s voting behavior. Of course the rural/urban divide is very present, but focusing on that doesn’t explain the full picture. We need intersectional examination. https://infogram.com/copy-data-comparison-1hmr6g78730go6n
I wouldn’t ever argue that men arn’t becoming more conservative. It’s clear that overall men have more conservative views on average and I even know some male trump voters who are educated coastal upper middle class people whereas I’ve yet to meet a woman of that demographic that is a conservative. But even that link you provided shows that more men voted Dem in 2024 than in 2016. This article is making is seem like every man is a conservative when we’re not that far from where we’ve always been.
Also, I would appreciate some empathy for men, even a little bit. It feels lonely as a liberal male when we try so hard to empathize and understand what women deal with but are constantly stereotyped, blamed, and our various small grievances with the culture are dismissed. Everything does not need to be a contest of who has larger problems/grievances, but it often feels that way.
This article takes the exact wrong approach: it paints every man as the most caricatured version of an ultra right man in order to push a mental theory claiming that men arn’t affected by anything and therefore don’t have a serious stake in politics. This is very patronizing and wrong but seems representative of what it often feels like talking with politically conscious women as a man — a sinking feeling that many of you are incapable of empathizing or understand any nuanced beliefs men might have but meanwhile men will see unfettered bold views by women and try our best to understand and empathize and not pathologize or villainize even when we disagree.
I don’t think she is “cherry-picking the worst men.” She took pains in the essay to say just that, to say Tyler was just an illustration but he was not the only such man she’s met. Her essay dwells pointedly on the possibility she may have to compromise her values to find a partner. That kind of thinking only enters someone’s mind at all when they’re looking around and seeing a lot of unsavory options. It looks to me as if you simply aren’t taking her word about what she sees around her. Funny thing is, I came into the comments to say, “It’s not all men, stick to your standards and values, keep looking.” But I didn’t expect to find someone so badly misreading the essay and taking the author to task over a straw man.
By the way, her reflectiveness in this essay rather shows she’s not an intransigent person who can’t countenance compromise in any way. She knows what her core values are, that’s all, and she isn’t compromising them. And indeed what are our values if not the key metric for moral judgments? “But compromise on some of your values? Yes” basically just means values are worthless, meaningless.
And it’s not “a fairy tale” to find someone whose values align well with yours. My friend Beth, in her seventies, held out for a better man through a series of duds. She found him, and now she’s having an inspiring late-in-life romance.
I mean . . .the example she's describing isn't some "we have disagreements on criminal justice reform" stuff . .there's a big big gulf in values shown and there's no way that relationship would ever last. Life is way too short to be with someone who doesn't share the core of what you perceive as important and moral in this world.
You crushed this. It is so telling and so sad that Joe Rogan and Dave Portnoy are seen as thought leaders by young men. Casual (along with active) cruelty and indifference is becoming way too normalized. And empathy and vulnerability are seen as uncool or liberal. Thank for your voice on this.
Hate when a good jawline is wasted on flimsy character!! Also, my non-political political litmus test used to be “What do you think about Elon Musk?” No longer as subtle, but, as you noted, there is no one left to DATE so it doesn’t really matter does it
So good Valerie. "I refuse to compromise on the things that make up my identity in the name of love or partnership. In the name of anything, really." I needed this today.
Well, this is one of the best written pieces I’ve seen here. I am an older man who watches with amazement and horror at the widening gap between young men and women. It’s easy to point to video games, porn addiction and right wing influencers as the primary influences of young men driving their failure. What I am believing more and more is that as women outperform men at all educational and professional levels, young men are retreating to safety in “bro” culture, widening the gap even further.
I have no answers, but your ethics and beliefs cannot be compromised for anyone. I look forward to more of your beautiful writing. Thank you. ☮️
I went on a semi-date with a dude who seemed totally normal until he said he wanted to "genocide trans people." He dropped it into the conversation casually (kinda joking? but obviously not?) as if I was going to agree with him.
We're so far apart, it seems like men are going back in time as women pick up our power.
I agree, the femicide + rape culture statistics don't lie. plus men like that don't deserve even a flicker of our essence. Better to invest our energy in community: other women, friends, family <3
brilliant piece and sharply written. wow. can't put into words how this piece walked the perfect line between empathy and calling for accountability. restacked so many quotes from this essay because it was banger line after banger line and with so much substance too. wonderful read!!
I adore this, you’ve written it exactly how it feels like to live as a “female” (A. Tate). So insightfully hard-hitting and painfully humorous that I can’t help but feel seen.
You have chosen a path that will likely end you up alone. You have chosen political dogma over love. How does that make you the winner? And it is a fact that men have a longer biological clock. So they can wait you out, as your value goes down.
“Sexual market value” is a mechanical way of putting it. The type of man who wants to get married and have children is looking for a woman who will be a good wife and mother, and who is fertile…because that’s kind of a prerequisite for being a mother. He doesn’t want some crazy political activist who’s going to treat him like an enemy and fill his kids’ heads full of insanity.
It is just a fact of reality that men can wait longer than women to accomplish those things. The bottom line is simple, which is that being left wing is not compatible with getting married and having a family. And as I said, that is by design. That is the actual intent of left wing ideology.
“Every time the conversation slips into abstractions, one of the women pulls it back to women’s complex everyday realities.” quote made me think of the recent clip of Saoirse Ronan on the Graham Norton show, when the other male actors on the couch are laughing about how ridiculous it would be to use your phone as a self defense weapon and "who would ever think to do that?!". And then she cuts in with "Women think about that every single day" and the entire room went silent and still...
I immediately thought of the exact same thing! It’s terrifying how accurate and relevant the quote is, and that we’re watching it unfold in real time.
Just sat and read through this while nodding constantly. Yes. A million times yes. Talked to a guy who said he liked Trump 'for his economy benefits' and he of course couldn't see past his white male privilege and understand why that's the most idiotic thing ever spoken. Needless to say, he's been blocked on everything and I sit in my feminist bed with my feminist blankets and my feminist books - alone. Happily alone with my “high” standards and with my values💋💕
The average man is not like this. Of course you shouldn't have low standards; all women should have standards they can live with. But cherry-picking the worst men and using those as stand-in representatives of the entire population of men is not helpful.
This essay would be the same as a man saying "the average woman is a hyper-liberal, money-grubbing, brainwashed, anti-family, weaponized-compassion leftie who just wants to put a dog leash on me and show the world how she finally tamed the oppressor." Which is, obviously, profoundly untrue. The vast majority of women are not like that. The vast majority of women are just trying to get by and find someone to love them. Same as most men.
What you're doing is nothing more than the direct opposite of the manosphere you apparently hate so much. Essays like this accomplish nothing other than to further echo negative sentiments that are solving exactly zero problems.
And yes, you do have to compromise to make relationships work. I don't know why we've forgotten that. Compromise on your most important values? Of course not. But compromise on some of your values? Yes. Anything else is a fairy tale.
If the result of the election doesn’t peel the veil of “the vast majority of men is not like this” I don’t know what does anymore lol. You are trying to frame this phenomenon as an ideological divide and this logic just doesn’t work when one group’s rights are at risk lmao.
And yet just as many women voted for Trump as men.
Which means that this issue cannot be simply boiled down to gender.
Which means that yes, it is an ideological divide.
where does the claim “just as many women voted for Trump as men did” come from? You can’t just make a claim without backing it up with voting statistics. There has been, historically, a gender gap in voting behavior, and 2024 is no exception. https://infogram.com/gender-gap-in-voting1992-2024-all-voters-1hnq41o3mmepk23
I think if you looked at the demographics of men that someone interacting in this substack would meaningfully have to interact with (men living in or around large liberal urban centers), you'd find that the *vast majority* of them voted Dem. You're making the same error that people who talk about "red states" and "blue states" make which is that the real divide is urban / rural and city Alabama will have more Dem voters than going 50 miles east of San Francisco.
I wonder how do you explain the existing gender gap between men and women’s voting behavior, and the changes in different racial demographic’s voting behavior. Of course the rural/urban divide is very present, but focusing on that doesn’t explain the full picture. We need intersectional examination. https://infogram.com/copy-data-comparison-1hmr6g78730go6n
I wouldn’t ever argue that men arn’t becoming more conservative. It’s clear that overall men have more conservative views on average and I even know some male trump voters who are educated coastal upper middle class people whereas I’ve yet to meet a woman of that demographic that is a conservative. But even that link you provided shows that more men voted Dem in 2024 than in 2016. This article is making is seem like every man is a conservative when we’re not that far from where we’ve always been.
Also, I would appreciate some empathy for men, even a little bit. It feels lonely as a liberal male when we try so hard to empathize and understand what women deal with but are constantly stereotyped, blamed, and our various small grievances with the culture are dismissed. Everything does not need to be a contest of who has larger problems/grievances, but it often feels that way.
This article takes the exact wrong approach: it paints every man as the most caricatured version of an ultra right man in order to push a mental theory claiming that men arn’t affected by anything and therefore don’t have a serious stake in politics. This is very patronizing and wrong but seems representative of what it often feels like talking with politically conscious women as a man — a sinking feeling that many of you are incapable of empathizing or understand any nuanced beliefs men might have but meanwhile men will see unfettered bold views by women and try our best to understand and empathize and not pathologize or villainize even when we disagree.
I don’t think she is “cherry-picking the worst men.” She took pains in the essay to say just that, to say Tyler was just an illustration but he was not the only such man she’s met. Her essay dwells pointedly on the possibility she may have to compromise her values to find a partner. That kind of thinking only enters someone’s mind at all when they’re looking around and seeing a lot of unsavory options. It looks to me as if you simply aren’t taking her word about what she sees around her. Funny thing is, I came into the comments to say, “It’s not all men, stick to your standards and values, keep looking.” But I didn’t expect to find someone so badly misreading the essay and taking the author to task over a straw man.
By the way, her reflectiveness in this essay rather shows she’s not an intransigent person who can’t countenance compromise in any way. She knows what her core values are, that’s all, and she isn’t compromising them. And indeed what are our values if not the key metric for moral judgments? “But compromise on some of your values? Yes” basically just means values are worthless, meaningless.
And it’s not “a fairy tale” to find someone whose values align well with yours. My friend Beth, in her seventies, held out for a better man through a series of duds. She found him, and now she’s having an inspiring late-in-life romance.
I mean . . .the example she's describing isn't some "we have disagreements on criminal justice reform" stuff . .there's a big big gulf in values shown and there's no way that relationship would ever last. Life is way too short to be with someone who doesn't share the core of what you perceive as important and moral in this world.
“Once again, women are painted as the cornerstone of not just our own loneliness, but men’s too — and everything wrong with society today” !!!!!!!!!
You crushed this. It is so telling and so sad that Joe Rogan and Dave Portnoy are seen as thought leaders by young men. Casual (along with active) cruelty and indifference is becoming way too normalized. And empathy and vulnerability are seen as uncool or liberal. Thank for your voice on this.
Hate when a good jawline is wasted on flimsy character!! Also, my non-political political litmus test used to be “What do you think about Elon Musk?” No longer as subtle, but, as you noted, there is no one left to DATE so it doesn’t really matter does it
So good Valerie. "I refuse to compromise on the things that make up my identity in the name of love or partnership. In the name of anything, really." I needed this today.
Well, this is one of the best written pieces I’ve seen here. I am an older man who watches with amazement and horror at the widening gap between young men and women. It’s easy to point to video games, porn addiction and right wing influencers as the primary influences of young men driving their failure. What I am believing more and more is that as women outperform men at all educational and professional levels, young men are retreating to safety in “bro” culture, widening the gap even further.
I have no answers, but your ethics and beliefs cannot be compromised for anyone. I look forward to more of your beautiful writing. Thank you. ☮️
thank you so much Barry 🤍 i appreciate this beyond words & hope to continue creating pieces you enjoy!
I went on a semi-date with a dude who seemed totally normal until he said he wanted to "genocide trans people." He dropped it into the conversation casually (kinda joking? but obviously not?) as if I was going to agree with him.
We're so far apart, it seems like men are going back in time as women pick up our power.
From an older women: you can still sleep with the ones with good jaws and bad politics, just don't have kids with them.
No - don’t even -or ever -sleep with them.
I agree, the femicide + rape culture statistics don't lie. plus men like that don't deserve even a flicker of our essence. Better to invest our energy in community: other women, friends, family <3
this whole piece was amazingly written 👏🏻 also, hi I live in Oklahoma and that little part made me laugh bc you're so right 🤦🏻♀️
okie born n raised and yeah that sums it about up 🫠
brilliant piece and sharply written. wow. can't put into words how this piece walked the perfect line between empathy and calling for accountability. restacked so many quotes from this essay because it was banger line after banger line and with so much substance too. wonderful read!!
I adore this, you’ve written it exactly how it feels like to live as a “female” (A. Tate). So insightfully hard-hitting and painfully humorous that I can’t help but feel seen.
Beautifully written, yet sharp as a knife
thank you Daniel! 🙇🏻♀️
Footnote #6 is a think piece on its own for SURE! Where do I even begin elaborating on that comment alone…
Loved this. Reflects my qualms on dating in— or lack of dating in— big American cities 🤡
All the Tylers in the comments freaking out because there’s a lot more Valeries who won’t compromise for the BS. It’s you bro—not her!
You have chosen a path that will likely end you up alone. You have chosen political dogma over love. How does that make you the winner? And it is a fact that men have a longer biological clock. So they can wait you out, as your value goes down.
can't talk about love if all you know is sexual market value speak joe
“Sexual market value” is a mechanical way of putting it. The type of man who wants to get married and have children is looking for a woman who will be a good wife and mother, and who is fertile…because that’s kind of a prerequisite for being a mother. He doesn’t want some crazy political activist who’s going to treat him like an enemy and fill his kids’ heads full of insanity.
It is just a fact of reality that men can wait longer than women to accomplish those things. The bottom line is simple, which is that being left wing is not compatible with getting married and having a family. And as I said, that is by design. That is the actual intent of left wing ideology.